Cook & Serve Coffee Cans: Including a Tacoma Coffee Service

Ev,
bit of a catch-up
While tidying I found I DO have a Danzig and one is enough.
Jeremy.
PS I also found a few of my Rorstrand cups and Rorstrand Tango coffee set.
Some pattern names: Fenix (h/p bird), Eden (h/p halved apple), King (h/p another bird), Curtis or Cedric or similar (I think, geometric), others buried around the place too.
Is there any interest in posting pics?

That's great that you found your Danzig Jeremy
I would like to see the Rorstrand Tango coffee set please ....

I was going through the database today and noticed that Danzig had the shape numbers 782/792 beside the name!!!!! Heather confirmed that 782 are cups on her notes from the Museum and the 792 can only be the saucer for that Danzig cup! So that gives us two new shapes for the Crown Lynn Shapes Gallery

Photo courtesy of Banker to show this Mogambo coffee can that has the shading in reverse .....?

I don't think I have underglaze mogambo in reverse but I do have reverse in hand-painted mogambo!
Also various others with transfers upside down (I guess this is how they get reversed), notably saraband.

(Correction: I have been looking thru my collection and it appears my Mogambo reverse is u/g transfer, like banker's one.)

ev,
Amongst my may C&S saucers are some black ones with the name "Viking":
do you have any idea what this might refer to?
I just made a search and found no entries under this name.

Having just built corner cabinets for my late father's Victorian glass (well maybe half of his 300 pieces) I just had one piece of wall area remaining in the dining room.
I built an open cabinet of 3/8 (10mm) rimu just big enough to house six hand-painted cups and saucers on three shelves: this hangs by small brass chains from three rafters (two to brace and one to pull it against the wall) and is tied by a fourth to the chair rail.
If I could remember the upload process I'd show you.
Then I discovered where I could show one each of the remaining sixteen under-glaze and plain c&ss over two shelves which I have yet to hang.
That leaves the Rorstrand cans to display display somewhere!
I'd also like to show some sets, with coffee pots etc but have run out of room.

When my brother and his family visit from Sweden in the summer I plan to assemble a 6 set of hand-painted Blue Tango c&ss with a Blue Tango coffee pot to take back and confuse the Swedes, who might think it is Rorstrand until otherwise advised.

It's so nice to see you back here Jeremy
Please email photos to the site on newzealandpottery@gmail.com and I will post them for you, as I'm keen to see exactly what you've done with your coffee cans.
There are a few Viking patterns on the Patterns Database and I will check them out when I get a chance and let you know what I can find.
We have identified one of the patterns that you didn't have a name for .... the one with green and pink 'trees' http://newzealandpottery.forumotion.net/gallery/Crown-Lynn-Tableware-Patterns/A-B-C-D/Conifer-PatNo917-pic_2693.htm
Here is the topic on how to post photos which might help you remember how to do it -
http://newzealandpottery.forumotion.net/t225-this-is-how-it-s-done-good-luck-d

thanks for all that ev,
I'll see if I can get a decent picture tomorrow. I'll just be lazy and email.
I'll try to get the other shelves up next week and get the full set on display on their saucers, even dig out Danzig!

Just remembered another of your coffee can patterns that Marl gave us the name for -
http://newzealandpottery.forumotion.net/gallery/Crown-Lynn-Tableware-Patterns/E-F-G-H/Form-d382-pic_2694.htm
Plus I want to add that this topic is the 3rd most viewed topic on the site

One last thing - Viking Pat.No. 458 is on the Database, but I've only ever seen the black coffee can saucers listed, hopefully the cups will turn up sometime.

Thanks Ev,
That gives a name to every pattern of C&S can I have now.

Do the colours have names? As they appear left to right on the posted photo of my collection they are: the standard blue of C&S saucers; a lime green which sits on Form pattern saucers; the insipid beige/yellow seen on much CL; and the standard yellow of C&S saucers.
Other colours of C&S saucer for which a name would be nice are the burgandy/red/pink of Mexico saucers and the brown of Napoli.
Somewhere I think I also have grubby olive green one, but I don't know what cup that might belong to.

Ev wrote: I would like to see the Rorstrand Tango coffee set please ....

I can't see any evidence of my having done this.
I will attempt to do so tomorrow.
My set is the later design that belongs with black ring saucers, not the red ones I have for my Tango cups.
I will email but am happy for you to post.

Regarding the name of the colour glaze colours, you will find the ones we have identified in the Patterns Gallery under Colour Glaze.  There are so many colours yet to be identified and there is a list of these colours in this topic - http://newzealandpottery.forumotion.net/t876-colour-glaze-by-crown-lynn which shows the names that Crown Lynn used, but we still have to match up the colour with those names!

Hand Painted Cans
Five of the 6 hand-painted Cook & Serve coffee can patterns, with the green stamp underneath, had matched saucers in plain colours (black, maroon, yellow, blue) bearing the same gree name stamp; Fleurette patterned cans had Fleurette patterned saucers.

Cans with Underglaze Transfers
Generally (but not always) saucers for these cans are under-stamped in black with "Cook & Serve" and no pattern name. (Some cans and saucers bear different stamps which may be an indication of who they were produced for or time of production.)
A range of C&S coffee cans may have been sold (1) with or (2) without saucers, for use as either as cup and saucer (1) or mug (2). I say this because they are so often seen without. A set of cans is a set of cans with or without saucers!

Where u/g transfer patterns reproduce the hand-painted designs (Blue Tango, Image, Mogambo), I expect the saucer to follow the colour cues of the hand-painted duos.

In matching an unnamed C&S saucer colour to a patterned coffee can there may have been a degree of choice from the outset, thus I see Saraband on yellow OR black as indicated near the start of this thread. Those with multi-coloured geometric patterns, Tacoma, Bermuda, and Athens look good on saucers of any of the colours included in their patterns, perhaps less so black. The only one of these patterns I've seen with a named saucer is Athens, which is blue.

Some other patterns do appear to have had dedicated saucer colours, American Styled Blue Sapphire (a floral design) has named blue saucers. Ev has said that she remembers a set of Napoli on brown saucers. They certainly look good on the brown, but, curiously, (and I have no explanation for this) the only brown saucers I have have a GREEN c&S stamp.

C&S Duos with Matched Patterns
The only examples I have are (hand-painted) Fleurette (green stamp) and Form (no stamp on cup and black C&S stamp on saucer).

Sundry U/G Can Patterns
One would expect the saucer for Danzig to be blue but like u/g Blue Tango I think it a poor colour match. For Conifer I would like to see a pink saucer (I haven't ever seen one) as the maroon (of Mexico) is too dark, but as the design has black in it the black is a good look. I suspect that one day I will see a saucer in Conifer pattern. (My sole Conifer cup has no understamp.)

Plain Coloured C&S Cans
I have these in blue, yellow, oyster, and lime. None has an understamp. I can only guess the saucer match. I see a great opportunity for harlequin sets, mix and match cup and saucer colours, as the matched duos are so boring. The only one of these I have bought with saucers are the lime which were paired with Form saucers, and together look better than Form on Form.

Sundry Patterned Saucers
In looking through my collection I see I have a pair of sauces with an as yet unnamed pattern. The pattern of three outlined fern leaves in black blue black is repeated four times around the saucer bowl. Understamp is black C&S. Blue cups look OK there, but I look forward to seeing cans in the same pattern.

Sundry Plain Saucers
Somewhere around, I believe I have a grubby green Crown Lynn saucer that matches the C&S shape but I know of no cup, plain or patterned to match it.

Sundry Saucers, Other Brands
It is more usual to find cans without saucers than saucers without cans.
If you have a saucer that fits, why not use it! I have a green "Made In England" saucer that nearly matches the Crown Lynn specification. I keep it with my collection because it fits.
As Crown Lynn's Cook & Serve coffee can range was based on the (shape) specification for cans and saucers from Swedish maker Rorstrand they make a good match. As I write there is a set of six Rorstrand Tango pattern cans for sale on Crown Lynn saucers on trademe.

Whew!

Besides the Cook & Serve line Crown Lynn produced at least two other lines of coffee can of approximately the same size and shape (wider than high).

The "530" range is approximately 4mm wider and 4mm higher than the C&S cans and slightly thicker material. The ring that sits in the saucer is set well in from the edge of the cup. The ceramic is white, but not vitrified china like C&S. The patterns appear to be a transfer over crisp white glaze. This range is not as sturdy as Cook & Serve. I wouldn't put them in a dishwasher. Patterns inlcude 530 "Purple Myrtle", 531 "Arthur & Martha" (not yet illustrated in the patterns tables), and d532 "Captain Sharples". These three patterns are all a bit psychedelic, a bit "Yellow Submarine".
My Purple Myrtles were issued on black colourglaze saucers in a box marked "Happenings".

Another cup I have just located is the same size as the "530"s but has the bottom ring at the edge of the cup. This example has a green transfer or print on or under yellowed white glaze (this pattern is not in the tables). It has a black Kelston Potteries understamp. I'm sure I have similar cups somewhere here.

Both these lines have reproduced the handle of the C&S can.

Any further information would be appreciated. (Maybe a new thread is required.)

The (green) backstamp on my two black Viking C&S saucers, in an upright sans serif font, reads:
VIKING/Pat No. 458/Permanent Underglaze Colours/OVEN PROOF/KELSTON POTTERIES/NEW ZEALAND

If numbers are an indication of production or design date this places Viking between Image (457) and Athens (465), which is the largest number in the 400s. Image was first issued as a hand-painted design with green backstamps and the later underglaze cups have black stamps; the only Athens cups I have are under-glaze transfer and stamped in BLACK (or unstamped), but I also have  both yellow saucers and blue saucers for Athens, GREEN stamped Kelston Potteries. (All read ATHENS/Pat No. 465/KELSTON POTTERIES/NEW ZEALAND.)

If we accept some consistency, which may not be the case for Crown Lynn, a possible conclusion would be that Viking and Athens were both produced originally as hand-painted designs and later reproduced as u/g transfer. Their issuing as Kelston Potteries rather than Crown Lynn Cook & Serve muddies the waters.
I hope one day to see some Viking cups, but do not expect them to be hand-painted.

Those patterns marked below with one * were originally issued as hand-painted cup with green name stamp, on named plain colour saucers (except Fleurette which has a Fleurette patterned saucer).
Those with ** were also later issued as underglaze transfers, black name stamp, on saucers green-stamped OVEN PROOF COOK & SERVE by Crown Lynn.
No * indicates name in black under cup with green-stamp saucers as above.

Exceptions: Danzig has Crown Lynn but not Cook and Serve on its stamp. Napoli appears to be an overglaze transfer rather than underglaze, and its stamp has Cook & Serve but "W.B. & Coy. Product" in lieu of Crown Lynn. My Form cups and Conifer cups are unstamped, as are some of my Athens. Some Blue Sapphire cups are incorrectly marked Saraband.

Plain colour cups have (3 digit) impressions only, no black or green stamp. Patterned cups also appear to have an impressed alpha-numeric stamp but they are pretty unreadable.

Patterned Cups
300s:
Fleurette* (373)
Form (382)
400s:
Blue Tango** (423)
Mogambo** (428)
Mexico (429)
Allegro (456)
Image** (457)
Viking (458)
Athens (465)
800s:
Blue Sapphire (823)
Form (832)
Saraband (869)
Bermuda (870)
Tacoma (871)
Napoli (885)
900s:
Conifer (917)
Danzig (935)

Single-Colour Cups:
Tango Blue (FY2)
Lime (FY2)
Yellow (bright) (25E)
Yellow (c&s) (25E)
Yellow (oyster? (25E)

Sundry
unknown saucer pattern (???)

I have just made an inventory of my Cook and Serve cans and Saucers.
The Tally is cans 201, saucers 154 (that I can currently locate).
I have all those items listed above, in varying numbers from 1 to 15, including six sets (with correctly named saucers) of all the hand-painted except Fleurette, for which I only have 4 cups and two saucers.
All but the unknown saucer pattern are illustrated above or elsewhere in the forum.
I have given to friends four sets each comprising 6 cups and saucers in underglaze Bermuda, Image, and Mogambo (2)


If you have any I don't please add pictures, names numbers etc.

Jeremy Ashford wrote:I have just made an inventory of my Cook and Serve cans and Saucers.
The Tally is cans 201, saucers 154 (that I can currently locate).

That is a whole lot of coffee cans Jeremy and I'm just trying to visualise them all !!!!  
I'm very keen to see the pattern on the no name can that you have, so please send pics.

Ev wrote:That is a whole lot of coffee cans.

Sure is. I have thee bins full of Crown Lynn and Rorstrand cans. One is just saucers.
I'm trying to match cans to saucers to make sets of six where I can, then I will be able to get rid of some.
Others I know I will never complete seats.

It would be great to find another can collector so I could make some swaps.
I have other lines I want to be rid of too:
Is there a market in the forum, besides the WANTED string?
 

Ev wrote:I'm very keen to see the pattern on the no name can that you have, so please send pics.

I'm working up to post some pictures but the latest is I can't find my camera!
Uploads will include cans, saucers, C&S coffee pots, Rorstrand Tango coffee set, and maybe some surprises.

I'd be very interested to see your pics too if and when you find that camera!

Jeremy there is no reason why you can't use the Wanted to Buy topic to add a Wanted to Swap thread. I'm not sure about using this site to sell as there are enough sites that do that already. Actually Trademe would be the best place to off load parts of your collection as that is where the collectors lurk.

In Val Monk's latest blog post she mentions how Tom Clark told her he was keen on Scandinavian design and did a trip over there to check them out ....
check this out just below the Narvik jug

http://valputaruru.blogspot.co.nz/2013/07/more-opshop-treasures.html

My latest info on the Rostrand coffee can is that the Marianne Westman Tango cup may date from as early as 1954 when Westman started at Rorstrand. The Westman part of the can is the hand painted PATTERN. She designed many of those. Some of the most collectable Westman patterns are "Delikat", which was used on a can, and "Picknick".

The cup SHAPE appears to be the work of Hertha Bengtson who started at Rorstrand in 1941.

Some of this information comes from the Rorstrand Museum in Sweden and some from

www.tallbacken.net

Unfortunately none of this source material is in English.
I'm also finding lots of lovely new (quite old actually) Rorstrand designs which I have yet to compile.

While this may appear to be getting away from the subject of Crown Lynn cans, what I am attempting to do is assemble a provenance for the shape design, and bearing in mind that the Crown Lynn is a copy of the Rorstrand, that provenance is shared.