Breakfast and Father cups: jumbo E/W 3016 and jumbo vit 3613

jumbo E/W 3016 and jumbo vit 3613

Following up information from Janice wrt lightweight hotel cups I think we can now safely identify the E/W jumbo cup as 3016 "Fathers Cup" and the vit jumbo cup (new shape!) as the 3613 "Breakfast Cup". (I will not bother with 3 and 4 digit issues at this stage.)

Tango pattern for THC was produced in the 3613 shape.
https://www.newzealandpottery.net/t5643-found-a-1966-article-on-light-weight-vitrified-ware#22118
I have just realised that my red jumbo is Red Tango and vitrified.
As is usual with vit and E/W in the same shape the vit is smaller.

Note height and width differences E/W vs vitrified.
Left: E/W 3016 99mm OD top x 78 H x 55 base
Right vit 3613 95 OD top x 75 H x 53 base
Neither cup is marked.

I may have some corrections to make to my vit c/s guide:
https://www.newzealandpottery.net/t5249-vitrified-cups-and-saucers-a-guide

I would still like to wait until a Fathers cup turns up Jeremy.

Are you wanting one with "Father" written on it Ev?

The vit jumbo tulip is documented so there should be no issues there.
The colour matches that of the Red Tango pattern and tango was produced in the 3616 shape, and the photo in the tango link appears to be the same (but blue).

Through the numbering and descriptions the 3016 is the same shape as the 3616 but E/W.

Yes I am waiting for a Fathers cup to show up, because in my minds eye I see that breakfast cup with the flat bit on the top of the handle.

I think the vitrified cup clinches it. Date and pattern fit the date of the article:
3613: Breakfast cup as 3016 6.12.65
Article: Tango, July 66

If you are not happy with that as the 3613 for the vit jumbo you'll have to find another number for it but I don't think there is one going spare. And then you would have to find an example of a flat-top-handle vitrified version as well for the 3613.

There is no other 4-digit description to fit the vit jumbo tulip and the colour is a match for the Red Tango, which I believe did not exist before 4-digit numbers commenced.

I think the Red Tango colour was first (only?) used on Red Tango.
It is close to but appears to be not as dark as the lids on the Vision bakeware on my examples.

Could you please show the drawing of the 3026, as you have noted that it looks like a jumbo.

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See also 2 different Fleurette breakfast cups at ...

https://www.newzealandpottery.net/t3186-need-help-with-this-jumbo-sized-cup-please#10993 (flat top handle)

... and:

https://www.newzealandpottery.net/t3186-need-help-with-this-jumbo-sized-cup-please#11037 (tulip-type handle, plus shape guide)

I think the latter (round top) will probably have replaced the former (flat top).

I think the 2nd from the left is the Fathers breakfast cup.  Do you have a number for this shape Jeremy?


Also this shows the vitrified cup shapes as of 1968

No extra numbers for pic 1.

Pic 2, second from right looks to be a problem as it matches neither big cup.
There are omissions: ie not all vit cups produced in 1968 are shown.
Gotta go out to Black Grace.
More thoughts later.

2nd from the right is 3616 isn't it? It's in the gallery as that number.

Yes I think it must be. Looks taller narrower in photo than in Val's pic in gallery.

Black Grace was magic.

Confirmation courtesy of the Portage Ceramics Collection that this is the 3016.
Which makes the 3613 correct as well

http://www.nzmuseums.co.nz/account/3384/object/489743/Cup_-_Colour_glaze

Portage has examples of the earlier breakfast/fathers cups, 802 and 832.

They are interesting to have a look at because those shapes caused us so much grief in identifying the later jumbos, above.

802
http://www.nzmuseums.co.nz/account/3384/object/487741/Cup_-_drive_carefully

832
http://www.nzmuseums.co.nz/account/3384/object/488193/Cup_-_banded

Portage 802 looks nothing like the Museum pic huh?
I will have to check that out when the Museum opens!@!

Ditto with the 832 shape ...... must check these out !!!